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Posted to the mailing list - Fear or No Fear? That is the question!

People always want the government to handle all of the people's problems. Whether or not there are funds available to service the needs of justice to assure innovators of a safe passage of their conceptual dream to a final market place reality would probably be unlikely. I might be wrong, but I think there is a need to be filled, obviously, just from what comes through here at InventNet. I have no problem with someone trying to make an "honest straight forward buck", however, don't be sneaky with me and not tell me all the facts, especially when your very much aware of less costly avenues of approach and especially when you very well know that the individual you're dealing with is a novice or beginner in his or her endeavor. Somehow, someway, there must be a simple solution to address and expose, people and or organizations who willingly and knowingly scam others. We have lots of computers for communicating with one another. We should at least be able to identify the known scammers in this country through some database somewhere! If the database doesn't exist, create it. That would at least be a start...

- D. W.

In response the following was posted to the mailing list.

D. and all

I decided to open a section dedicated on scams at InventNET web site. This section will contain a web page with innovators complains on SCAM companies and another web page that will list these companies. To do this I will need your help with bringing these companies to my attention. Remember that we need proof in order to accuse someone.
To send your complains please use my email address:

- V. L.
InventNET - Mailing List
http://www.inventnet.com

M. C. & Y. R. wrote the mailing list asking:

Forgive another novice question...

What do most people use for a logbook? Tom Mosley's book (Marketing Your Invention) says use one with the pages sewn and numbered. Where do you get something like that... just buy a "blank book" and number the pages?

M. and Y.:

The essence of an inventor's logbook is this: Imagine yourself in court, and a judge looking at your notebook. If it were a three-ring binder, the judge might assume that you backdated an entry, and just inserted it. So, your notebook would carry little weight. Sewn in pages are essential, and they should be renumbered by the publisher, not numbered by you. You could consider using a numbered/sewn bookkeeping book that has two or more columns. Not as neat as a lab book, but acceptable.

Best wishes,

- J. L.

Several other responses to this novice inquiry were posted on the mailing list as well.

Posted to the mailing list - An Inventor's Story

This is a brief outline of my progress over the past few months in sorting out the step-by-step decisions I have made in order to ultimately get a new product introduced into the market place.

1.) Committed myself to "one" single idea out of the numerous product concepts I have stock piled away.

2.) Chose a product concept idea which I felt was economically viable for me to manufacture on a small scale.

3.) Wrote an extremely detailed product description with drawings.

4.) Spent weeks building prototypes and finally came up with a successful design. A design that kept special tooling needs to an absolute minimum but achieved a good looking and well made product result.

5.) Gave the product a name/logo and claimed it with a TM marking.

6.) Unsuccessfully tried to approach a manufacturer. They were afraid of me and did not like my nondisclosure agreement. Also told me that I needed a patent before they would talk to me.

7.) Got depressed.

8.) Got mad!

9.) Took action! Filed a very detailed PPA. ( Thank you D. P., and C., for suggesting his book to me. )

10.) Ordered enough material to build 1,000 units so that I could perform a local test market response.

Right now this is where I am, in the manufacturer's stage and I hope to complete this task inside of one month. Then my plan is to build one display rack with a sharp looking advertising banner, take some photos of this display to use in making my sales pitch, and then hitting the local WalMart or K-Mart and see if I can get one of them to commit to seeing me through the exclusive sales of all 1,000 test market samples. If this works and the product sells, well then, back to the manufacturer's doorstep with the proven fact that the product will move. ( Hopefully well, otherwise I've failed and no manufacturer will talk to me. )

It’s a big gamble in some aspects ( the work to build the units myself ), but at least I won't lose my shirt if the product doesn't sell well. I can always reduce my cost to the retailer and still not lose my entire investment. However, obviously that's not what I'm looking for.

Any comments?

By the way, the product is a clever dual-purpose vehicle care item.

- D. W.

Replies Posted to the mailing list - An Inventor's Story

Re: An Inventor's Story

Good story D. - looks like you have really assessed your investment risks and have made an informed "plunge".  some comments below:...

1) Talk with the TOP manager at your local retailer - but be ready for them to say they do not have local purchasing authority,
2) If they are receptive, let them know that you will provide the product on CONSIGNMENT - they don't pay until it sells,
3) Let them know that you will check the display daily, keep it full, and keep it looking good,
4) Tell them that the test will be for a specified time (like 3 weeks) so they know that you will remove it without hassle if they want it out of the store,
5) Ask them for consideration in letting you install or set up the display in a high traffic area representative of the traffic area it will see in the real world - this will be a true test. Putting it at the checkout stand is the producer's dream, putting it in the cat food aisle is a waste. Possibly ask for
some space on an "end cap" - end of aisle; he will probably laugh because this is premium space, but you won't get it if you don't ask,
6) Possibly tell him that you will run a SMALL advertisement in your local newspaper - this will be a benefit to him even if you don't sell a single product, and lets him know you understand the art of merchandising.
7) Don't be afraid to contact one of your drive-through car washes which have a car boutique, or a local auto parts store.  If the product sells there, it is just a valid a market test as in the big box stores.

Good luck.

- A.

Re: An Inventor's Story.

D., A., and all:

I would add:  Don't expect that just because you are consigning an item to a retailer that you should expect to give him/her a small percentage of the sale, e.g.., and 25 percent.  Most merchandise sold on a regular invoice basis is not paid for in less than 60 days, etc. So, if you are leaving your stuff on consignment, and you are going to take it out after 45 to 60 days, let's say, if I were a retailer giving you valuable space, and a trial at sales, I'd tell you I wanted at least 40 percent - - maybe 50 percent of the net price.

Our motives in such a test are not to make money, but to test the sales appeal.  Whatever we must do to sweeten the deal for the retailer is a bargain.

- J. L.

The story posted by D.W. started several more threads of conversations about trademarks, manufacturing costs, and market tests.

Basic question posted to the mailing list by newbie

I am very new at this and am just looking for some basic information on what to do with my "ideas". Do I try and get a patent or just try to find
a company who would be interested in my ideas? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

- J. L. A.

Again, the above posting from a novice received several responses. One example from the mailing list follows:

Hi J.,

I am on the list and I saw that you were looking for info. If you'd like, you can visit my web site. It explains some of the basics and recommends some books that will help you out. Just don't use one of those companies that advertise that they can market or patent your idea. They are scams. The best things to do, is to buy Patent It Yourself by David Pressman. Who is a member of this mailing list. It explains everything and also has all of the necessary forms for logging your ideas, doing searches and getting a patent. I would read this first and then ask the group for more info. 

Here are some extreme basics:

1. have an idea
2. log it in a research notebook (stitched notebook)
3. send a disclosure document to PTO (optional)
4. do a patent search (or hire a search firm to do it)
5. write a patent application and drawings (or get an atty. to do it)
6. send in your stuff plus your money (close to $400)
7. wait
8. receive your first office action
9. file an amendment if needed
10. receive your notice of allowance
11. pay $645 for issue fee
12. wait
13. patent issues
14. get a frame for it :-)

If you want to get money for your idea you either have to:  start or use it in your own company, sell the patent, or license the patent to a company. Most people advise licensing. There are a lot of books that can help you with any of these. You asked if you should just approach a company with your idea without patenting. I would say that depends on whether your idea is patentable. It has to be novel and unobvious. If you can patent it, then it's best to do so. Most companies won't even look at you if you don't at least have a patent pending. If you have any more questions, feel free to ask.

- C.

Posted to mailing list a reponse to a question about provisional patents.

<< Can someone tell me where I can get the forms to apply for  a provisional patent and is it difficult to fill out? If anybody can point me in the right direction and offer some help, I would greatly appreciate it. S. L. >>

There is no fixed form for a provisional application for patent, except that a cover sheet having certain information is required. The PTO has suitable cover sheets you can download from their site.

You want the following forms:

  PTO/SB/09 (SMALL ENTITY DECLARATION)
  PTO/SB/16 (THE COVER SHEET)
  PTO/SB/17 (FEE TRANSMITTAL FORM IS A CONVENIENCE)

A further description of the provisional application was given

- D. B.

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